Bar slanting and not noticing

[Gary Steele]

When im playing my bar slants to the right a little. I can think about it and soon as I start playing it will go right back. It looks right from a distance but the nose goes right a little. I think a lot of people does this not realizing. A friend of mine plays real good and does a lot of recording and tell me his bar does this. Its hard for me to put my index finger toward the right side of the bar to help keep it lined up. You dont notice unless you pay direct attention. After so many years how do you correct this. Big hand i may need a 14 string bar. I think i have one but so heavy.

[Dave Mudgett]

You posted this in Wanted to Buy. I moved over to Steel Without Pedals - you can't buy good slanting, LOL.

Edit -- when I read this more carefully, it's clearly a Pedal Steel topic about unintentional slanting. Sorry about that, I'll move it over there.

[John Watson]

Hey Gary. I'm certainly not a music teacher, but I'm thinking you might be able to correct that by slowing down your tempo when you're practicing and focus on getting the angle right every time. That will be training for your muscle memory to have the hand at the correct angle. You should then be able to get back up to speed with your hand working correctly. If you're always going at regular speed and the bar turns right you'll be sort of reinforcing your hand to do it the wrong way. With enough repetition at the correct angle you should be good, although practicing at slow speed is definitely boring.

[Tim Whitlock]

If I'm reading this correctly, he's saying the bar is not perfectly parallel to the frets, causing an intonation issue. Obviously that needs to be something to focus on when practicing, but adding some vibrato is a great way to mitigate intonation issues and adds character and expression to your playing.

[Bobby D. Jones]

Search the forum, For Mr. Franklin posts on proper bar size. To fit your hand, For proper bar control.

A short bar is hard to control with no anchor point.
If you have long fingers, You may need a longer bar.
So the back of the bar sits in the the pocket, Where your index finger, Thumb and palm junction. And long enough to extend to first joint of index finger.
This gives complete control of the back of the bar. Then use your thumb and middle finger to control the front of the bar. And index finger for needed down pressure on front tip of bar.

When I bought a S12U, A 11.5oz. 1" X 3 3/4" (12 String) bar, was in the case. Fit my hand better, But was heavy, Quick moves up and down the neck was hard to control and tired my left hand quickly. I drilled a 31/64" X 3 3/8" hole in the bar. Weight cut to 9.7oz. This now is, My go to bar.

[Donny Hinson]

When im playing my bar slants to the right a little. I can think about it and soon as I start playing it will go right back. It looks right from a distance but the nose goes right a little. I think a lot of people does this not realizing. A friend of mine plays real good and does a lot of recording and tell me his bar does this. Its hard for me to put my index finger toward the right side of the bar to help keep it lined up. You dont notice unless you pay direct attention. After so many years how do you correct this. Big hand i may need a 14 string bar. I think i have one but so heavy.

Your index finger should be on top of the bar, and maybe just slightly to the right of the center of the bar!

If the bar isn't pulled back far enough towards your palm, the natural tendency is for the bar to slant. The bar should be held by your thumb and the side-edge of your middle finger, with the index finger on top and your wrist angled slightly to the left. Watch your left hand and practice, practice, practice until you can hold it parallel to the frets.

[Gary Steele]

Thanks, I have a 4 inch bar and it still dont fit like pauls does. I think slowing tempo and watch bar. So many good players day they do this. My hand are real slick to. Tyvm

[Donny Hinson]

Men who work with their hands often develop hard and slick skin. Make sure you wash your hands, dry, and then it may help to use some lotion, like Jergens or Corn Husker's lotion to "supple them up". Rub the lotion in vigorously, wait a minute or two, and then wipe them off good with a clean rag paper towel.

[Jack Hanson]

...it may help to use some lotion, like Jergens or Corn Husker's lotion to "supple them up". Rub the lotion in vigorously, wait a minute or two, and then wipe them off good with a clean rag paper towel.

I agree. Moving from Minnie (the land of 10,000 lakes and 10,000% humidity) to a 7600' high valley in Colo where it's dryer'n a popcorn fart year-round, my bar was constantly slipping away until I began a regular regimen of applying lotion beforehand.

[Gary Steele]

Good info thanks alott

[Dave Mudgett]

Thanks, I have a 4 inch bar and it still dont fit like pauls does.

I have a pretty large hand with long fingers. I personally would find a 4-inch bar very long. Standard is 3-3/8", I typically use a BJS 15/16" x 3-5/8" bar, which is generally considered a 12-string bar. Maybe try a normal 12-string bar. I'll also say that I'm a bit uncomfortable with a typial 7/8" diameter bar - I can use one, but for me, it's not optimal. Msaybe try a few bars of different sizes.

Men who work with their hands often develop hard and slick skin. Make sure you wash your hands, dry, and then it may help to use some lotion, like Jergens or Corn Husker's lotion to "supple them up". Rub the lotion in vigorously, wait a minute or two, and then wipe them off good with a clean rag paper towel.

Yup - I use food-grade mineral oil or, if it's really crazy dry, vaseline. Definitely apply to clean wet hands. Give enough time to let it sink in, wipe it off, and let your hands dry. If you don't, the bar may well slide right out of your hands. The mineral oil also works great to keep my pompadour (at least what's left of it at 70+) up.

[Fred Treece]

The angle of the wrist to the forearm needs to change constantly when moving the bar up and down the length of the guitar neck in order to keep the bar straight.

Practice sliding up and down 1 fret at a time, then 2, then 3, etc. up to 12 frets. Focus on keeping the bar straight and hitting the target fret with as close to perfect intonation as you can. You will see how much the wrist/forearm angle changes from each starting point to end point, and create the muscle memory needed for the move. Cover the whole fretboard, including “Hugheyland” above fret 15. Try to stay as relaxed as possible in your shoulders, and try to minimize the sideways movement of your upper torso.

I got this from the Joe Wright “My Approach” method book.

[Fred]

Maybe it’s because I played lap steel for many years before moving to pedals, but I never really look to see that my bar is straight. I listen for it to be straight. Or slanted in tune. Slanting is pretty common on lap steel so listening for notes to be in tune with each other becomes second nature. There are times on the pedal steel when the notes I want are out of tune with a straight bar. It needs a little finesse to get them in tune.

[Thornton Lewis]

Playing octaves with a drone helped this pretty quickly for me.
Plus, if you can't think of something brilliant to say, repeating what you just said in octaves gives you some time to think and a same/same, but different place to say it.

[Gary Steele]

I think my hands and fingers being slick was most of my problem. Its like it want to slant immediately. Now that im thinking about it im going to start making sure I keep it straight. Played all my life without paying much attn to that. Thanks for all the info. I would like to go spend time with the right teacher that can tell by watching me that can tell me things that is most important. Years ago I spent 3 days with J. NEWMAN everyone said he would change my right hand. Luckily he told me it was ok. Thank God for that. Several people has told me there are a few guys that knows exactly how to know just by watching right away. I mainly want to know some kinda basic stuff about understanding more about several ways to use the 1st 2nd and 7th and 9th and the levers that works them. Even the 5 and 10 lower
I got in a rut where I use the major strings and the E. Levers. I dont want to over do it and take Mike, Paul, and Tommy's work, LOL AFTER 50 YEARS IV FOUND QUITE A BIT. BUT JUST THE SURFACE. ANY IDEAS WOULD BE NICE.
THANKS..

[Bobby D. Jones]

Have you changed guitars, A new seat, Changed knee levers under guitar? Changing your left hand approach angle to the fret board.